It's time for Part 2 of Cannabiz Media's Cannacurio podcast recorded at MJBizCon in Las Vegas this month. Watch the video below and listen to host Ed Keating talk to experts from OG Cannabis Insurance, March Networks, EZ Trim, Royal Supply, and Canna Carton about MJBizCon, what's on the horizon for the cannabis industry, and how they use the Cannabiz Media License Database to support their sales and marketing initiatives.

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MJBizCon Podcast Episode 2 Transcript

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Ed Keating:

Hi, this is Ed Keating at Cannabiz Media, and we're doing the Cannabiz Media Podcast live from the MJBizCon 2021. Today, we're joined by OG Cannabis Insurance and Manny Cuaron is with us. Manny, welcome.

Manuel Cuaron:

Thank you very much.

Ed Keating:

So got to ask, what does the OG stand for in your company name?

Manuel Cuaron:

So when we were developing our website, we wanted to incorporate what we felt was our talents and services and the cannabis industry in talking about what we feel is a top shelf policy and products. So the OG in the industry was the way of naming ourselves as a top shelf insurance company. And so we decided OG Cannabis Insurance was the easiest way to explain that. And it made a whole lot of sense for our website.

Ed Keating:

Now, I've known you for years coming to these shows and whatnot. So obviously, we're both here many years later. Thank goodness that our businesses have thrived. Tell me about who you service in the industry. Is it the whole value chain from growers right up to dispensaries or are there places that you focus on a little bit more deeply?

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah, that's right. So we can insure anybody in the license ecosystem, dispensaries to distribution to manufacturing. We're licensed in all legally cannabis licensed states. And we can also ensure all the ancillary businesses. 

So if you're security or consulting or construction, we've got insurance policies that are fully transparent with cannabis operations, the carriers know exactly what you're doing. So come claim time, there's no issues with claim denials or policy exclusions.

Ed Keating:

Oh, makes sense. Makes sense. Now, as you look at states and those that you cover, are there differences for you in terms of how you have to write the insurance if it's a medical state versus an adult state or one that has both?

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah. So each state has a different licensing compliance when it comes to insurance. Matter of fact, in California, there's even insurance requirements on the city level. And so what we do is make sure that your compliance on both of those sides, as far as insurance is concerned. 

As far as the other states, the things that really stand out are some of the weather related claims that are unique to, let's say, Oklahoma where you might have wind and hail and tornado season, or things in Florida where you might have-

Ed Keating:

Hurricane.

Manuel Cuaron:

Hurricane and all those other things. So yeah, it is a state and a case by case basis when we look at a policy, because every risk is going to be different.

Ed Keating:

Yeah. Yeah. So one of our customers in the insurance base came to us years ago and said, "Hey, when you're talking to processors, can you find out what extraction they do? Because," he says, "I'd like to know about volatile extraction or not." So is that something that is going to impact somebody's insurance as you write for them if you know that they're using, let's say, butane versus something more benign?

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah, absolutely. You hit it right on the nose. So part of the underwriting process of the care is you want to know all about your operations extraction, how you safeguard that. Do you have the right ventilation? Do you have a closed loop system?

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

And what method you're using, those are all underwriting questions. They're very important when it comes to covering the risk. So yeah, you hit it right on the nose.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

We do need to know that up front.

Ed Keating:

So when we first met many years ago, I was impressed because you were really doing a lot of your own research. In the California market, you were getting local licenses, you knew some of the same people that we did.

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah.

Ed Keating:

Now, as we look across and we see all these new states coming on board or expanding their programs, what does that mean for you and your team like New Mexico is going to expand their program? Or Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, how does that impact how you navigate forward?

Manuel Cuaron:

So number one, it's opportunity. It's an opportunity to continue what we do as a business. We definitely want to see the culture and business grow and become more mainstream. So what we do from a business aspect is we just go to those markets, introduce ourselves, talk to all the movers and shakers, and let them know exactly how we can help those businesses grow and protect them and do what we do.

Ed Keating:

Cool. Cool. And how does Cannabiz Media fit into your plans? How do we, hopefully, assist you in meeting some of those goals?

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah. So I mean the main thing that you guys do is get us that data. That data is super important. So we can get that initial outreach in marketing.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

And getting ahold of the right people and getting ahold of the right companies. So that way, we can help further our message much faster than what we can do on the ground.

Ed Keating:

Got it. And looking to Washington and all the discussion there about rules changing at the federal level, would any of those changes matter for you? Anything on [inaudible 00:04:46] or SAFE Banking, or is insurance its own enclave that wouldn't be affected by much of that?

Manuel Cuaron:

No. No. The SAFE Act have some regulations that's going to allow insurance companies to have those safeguards. And that's written into the legislation that we know is going to open up the doors for some of the larger carriers or some other carriers to increase capacity or risk. So we're looking forward to that. I think that's really important in step one. 

As far as the insurance is concerned and what we do for our clients, one of the biggest conversations we're going to have is going to be interstate traveling because we're going to have a lot of risk with just being the road and cargo and commercial auto coverages.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

And how that affects when you go into states. And so we're looking forward to that and we know that's going to be bringing a lot of opportunity for our agents.

Ed Keating:

Excellent. So does that come up in some states where, let's say, they do not have distribution licenses? Let's say I'm a grower and it's almost an implied license that I can drive my product to a manufacturer, does that factor into how you'd evaluate me versus a state like California that has a wholesale process in there?

Manuel Cuaron:

Sure. Yeah. It shouldn't be implied, you should have a license for it. If there's not a licensing system around in your state, we'll ask you exactly then what are you allowed to do per the state-

Ed Keating:

Yeah, yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

Guidelines, because that's how all these policies and the industry work. So we'll ask them, "Okay. So if you're growing and you're not transporting, then yes, how are you getting your product from point A to point B?" Because it is top of coverage and a risk that we need to know about, our clients need to know about. 

But more importantly, we do want to be sure that our clients are within the requirements of their state and local licensing, because that is a policy, a requirement. And if you're not, then these insurance companies will hold you to that. That's your burden to make sure you are so coverage can be applied when it's necessary.

Ed Keating:

Absolutely. Absolutely. So Manny, looking forward, hopefully we'll be here a year from now. It'll be the 2022 MJBizCon. What do you think is going to happen over the next 12 months? What trends might there be out there that we should be on the lookout for?

Manuel Cuaron:

I think M&As, that's been happening quite a bit. In the next 12 months, I think people are going to be looking towards the Biden administration to start at least the framework on federal deregulation.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

I would probably say that's going to happen in '25, 2025, '26-

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Manuel Cuaron:

More than likely. I think the industry's just going to grow. We're going to have more states that are going to actually start issuing licenses. There's a few states that's talking a lot about it in New York. Hopefully, everybody will see that state open up and we're just looking forward to growth.

Ed Keating:

Yeah. No, I would agree. After sitting in on the financial forum earlier on this week and seeing the slide to talk about growth, you're absolutely right that we see it definitely continuing to move up. And hopefully, we'll all be able to enjoy that as we move forward.

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah.

Ed Keating:

So Manny, thank you so much for coming by and talking to us about OG Insurance Services. This is great.

Manuel Cuaron:

You're very welcome.

Ed Keating:

Good to catch up.

Manuel Cuaron:

Yeah, absolutely. It was nice seeing you again, Ed, and hello everybody out there.

Ed Keating:

All right.

Ross Dillon:

I am here with my friend, Chris, from of March Networks. Correct?

Chris Jensen:

Yes. Thank you for having me. Appreciate it.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely. What's it like being back at MJBizCon after the year that was 2020?

Chris Jensen:

It is surreal to say the least.

Ross Dillon:

Isn't it really?

Chris Jensen:

So yes. This is my 10th MJBizCon, so I've been to every single one since the beginning. So it's amazing to see the growth and the evolution of the cannabis industry. And you can see it year after year at MJBizCon. So it's great to be back. And what I think about MJBizCon, it's always good to come to MJBizCon and realize the work that we do on a daily basis actually has a greater impact globally.

Ross Dillon:

It's fantastic.

Chris Jensen:

It's amazing to be here.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. It's really interesting, especially coming here. I haven't seen this really in any other industry.

Chris Jensen:

Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

Where it's like everybody here really wants to help everybody else succeed because they really just want to boost the industry to where it needs to be.

Chris Jensen:

100%, and we all care about the plan and we all care about the patients.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely, and that's the most important part about it. It's really refreshing to see, especially in this day and age.

Chris Jensen:

100%.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. So tell us what you guys are up to. What have you been working on?

Chris Jensen:

Right on. So March Networks, we're a global manufacturer of video surveillance equipment. So we make cameras, hardware, and software that powers the systems.

Ross Dillon:

Right.

Chris Jensen:

So we've been going coast to coast and spreading the word about video surveillance, but also trying to take it to the next level and help people understand they're making these huge investments in their technology suite. 

And it's not really necessarily the only thing you're going to do is do security and compliance. There's so much more you can do with video or your technology suite. We're trying to help people understand how you can maximize your profits, increase revenue per square foot and overall operational efficiency through the use of your video or other technologies.

Ross Dillon:

That's fantastic.

Chris Jensen:

Yeah. 100%.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. So have you had a good MJBizCon so far? Are you meeting up with a lot of people?

Chris Jensen:

I've had a great MJBizCon. I was able to dodge some shenanigans last night and get some rest. So I'm ready to hit up the-

Ross Dillon:

That's funny. Yeah, it's interesting. MJBizCon, people swinging in here at noon, right?

Chris Jensen:

Yes.

Ross Dillon:

We know what's up. We know what's going on.

Chris Jensen:

Absolutely. I wish I was one of them, but I had a booth.

Ross Dillon:

I know. Yeah, yeah. It's business first, I know. Maybe tomorrow night.

Chris Jensen:

Tonight, I'm going to have a really good time. I'm going to the Zodiac party and those are always fun. The [inaudible 00:10:02] and Fairchild party. So I'm glad they combined forces and decided to have one big, awesome party and we're going to see what it is. But yeah, I've made the mistake in years past the staying up way too late on the first couple of days.

Ross Dillon:

But you've got to live. You've got to do it at least once.

Chris Jensen:

Yeah, you've got to have fun.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely. So how are you all utilizing the Cannabiz Media Database?

Chris Jensen:

You know what? The Cannabiz Media Database has really been invaluable.

Ross Dillon:

Awesome.

Chris Jensen:

One, it gives us a ton of research on the cannabis industry. We're able to understand which markets are hot based on what the activity levels are. Excuse me. We've got not a large sales team, but there's 10 or 15 of us. And then we've got an inside sale team, and they've really embraced the Cannabiz Media platform to find out who to talk to, find out which brands are linked to which brands, understand who they're talking to before they go into a call. And based on the information that we're gathering from Cannabiz Media, it's been super invaluable for us.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Chris Jensen:

And we've been getting a ton of business as a result. Our entire marketing team is basing on what their marketing plan or where they're going to target their target markets based on the information they're getting from Cannabiz Media-

Ross Dillon:

Right.

Chris Jensen:

On the markets that are hot. So it it's a bigger enterprise play, they can shift their message to enterprise for Illinois or something like that.

Ross Dillon:

Right.

Chris Jensen:

If it's more of a the licenses are just being issued, then we have a different type of approach or a different marketing plan for those. And the information that you guys provide lets us do that.

Ross Dillon:

That's fantastic.

Chris Jensen:

It's been great.

Ross Dillon:

I really appreciate you stopping by for a quick minute and chatting with us.

Chris Jensen:

100%.

Ross Dillon:

This is fantastic. It's always great seeing you guys.

Chris Jensen:

Absolutely.

Ross Dillon:

We love working with you. We always talk-

Chris Jensen:

Absolutely. Thanks for having us and keep up the good work.

Ross Dillon:

No, you keep up the good work.

Chris Jensen:

There we go. Sign up for Cannabiz Media. There we go.

Ross Dillon:

Go sign up and go talk to this guy. 

Ross Dillon:

And I am here with my good friend from EZ Trim. How are you, sir?

Dave Zobl:

We go back a good three to four minutes.

Ross Dillon:

We do. We go back a good three to four minutes, but doesn't it feel like we go back a good-

Dave Zobl:

It does indeed.

Ross Dillon:

30 to 40 years at this point?

Dave Zobl:

It does indeed.

Ross Dillon:

After talking about this. It's unreal, this small world, the connections that you can make here and learn. It's just really unreal.

Dave Zobl:

You're an easy guy to connect with.

Ross Dillon:

Oh, well thank you so much. Stop it. Stop it. So what's it like being back at MJBizCon after the year that was 2020?

Dave Zobl:

No kidding. Hey, first off. Thanks for having me.

Ross Dillon:

By all means. Thank you for stopping by.

Dave Zobl:

Thanks for having our company EZ Trim here and we appreciate it. It's awesome to be back.

Ross Dillon:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Dave Zobl:

We've, as a relatively small company, been a very solid one. These shows are really important to us.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah. And they're also very fun too, but it's a great way for us to reconnect with current customers, but obviously develop relationships with new ones. And we've been fortunate over the years. And we've actually done probably, gosh, at least 10 shows in the last few months.

Ross Dillon:

Wow, really?

Dave Zobl:

Yeah. Not to the scope. MJB is the Rose Bowl of the whole deal. But all of them, it's just been great to be out and about again.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And you just can't beat face to face interaction. It's pretty tough to beat, yeah.

Ross Dillon:

You really can't beat that.

Dave Zobl:

I don't think so, especially for what we do, which is fairly tangible.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

It comes across via video and Zoom calls and phone calls, but there is nothing quite like the hands on experience.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely. So talk about EZ Trim. What have you guys been up to? What are you up to now?

Dave Zobl:

Absolutely.

Ross Dillon:

At least with all of it.

Dave Zobl:

Again, thank you for asking.

Ross Dillon:

Sure.

Dave Zobl:

We're a company based out of Colorado. We are founded by a gentleman by the name of Joe Black, who was a grower.

Ross Dillon:

Thank you, Joe.

Dave Zobl:

This is going back about a decade now. And he was getting a little bit frustrated with hand trimming and that whole process. And he's just one of those incredibly innovative inventor type people of which I couldn't be farther from.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And he created the same trimmer that we've had now for 10 years a decade ago. So it was born out of necessity, but also just being grower. And I think that's why our company... I'm the CEO, which is a fancy title, but I'm far and away the weakest link in the chain. Our team-

Ross Dillon:

Oh, I don't believe that for a second.

Dave Zobl:

Please.

Ross Dillon:

You have an amazing team.

Dave Zobl:

Well our team is all based on... They've all grown, done a lot of experiences. They've run dispensaries. They've had their own trim shops. And so they've covered every area of the industry.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

Which I think honestly, in the three and a half years I've been with EZ Trim, I've learned so much from them that it's been like getting your masters in a lot of ways. Because as you know, this industry, at least for me, it's just constantly learning and change and evolving. And that's also what makes it cool.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. But that's why I really love coming to conferences like this. And this is my first time, I really didn't know what to expect.

Dave Zobl:

Right.

Ross Dillon:

But to see everyone here working together to help each other to boost the industry as a whole-

Dave Zobl:

It's very true.

Ross Dillon:

You don't really see that in a lot of other industries.

Dave Zobl:

It's really true. And of course, we have competitors too.

Ross Dillon:

Right, absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

And that's good.

Ross Dillon:

There's an amicable respect. Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

The competition rises you up and helps you improve. And what we try to do, at least I try to do, is your biggest competition is usually yourself too.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

And always trying to find ways to improve and enhance what you do. And when you come to one of these, you realize, "Wow, there's so many different things we can do." It can be a bit overwhelming, so you have to take a deep breath and go step at a time. 

But yeah, there is that sense of camaraderie here. I think we all feel fairly lucky to be in an industry that sure goes like this, like most. But it's pretty hard to argue the potential upside and growth and the coolness of it. It's just a neat industry to be in. And I meet folks like you.

Ross Dillon:

Oh, stop it. This is exciting. Yeah, this is my first time here. I didn't really know what to expect, but really get to touch base with all of our clients and stuff like that.

Dave Zobl:

That's awesome.

Ross Dillon:

Meet them in person after I've chatted with them on [inaudible 00:15:58] and everything like that.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah. Absolutely.

Ross Dillon:

It's so cool to connect and actually meet in person instead of-

Dave Zobl:

I get it, and we've been with cannabis for what? I think three years now. And I met Davis at a show I believe, and instant rapport with him. He's a really solid person.

Ross Dillon:

Davis is a great human being.

Dave Zobl:

As is all of the cannabis team. And I think that's why it's been for us a... Sure, it's a great resource for what you do as far as getting licenses, but it also provides a lot. I get your daily emails and I get a lot of information from it. So it's really worked well for us. 

And your support team and staff have always just been very helpful because as a small company, we need help because we don't have our own IT department and those kind of things. So it really provides a heck of a resource for us.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. So moving into that, how do you guys utilize the database?

Dave Zobl:

Yeah. Well our job, what we do is we build harvesting and trimming equipment of course. So we work directly with growers. So when we...

Ross Dillon:

Perfect timing.

Dave Zobl:

There you go. So what we love about Cannabiz is it's pretty tough for us to keep track of licenses. For example, if a new state comes on, be it, it doesn't matter, Oklahoma or wherever it is, you guys do the heavy lifting on that end. So that provides literally the information for us. And that is invaluable because for us to track that down is pretty tough to do. So that's our first way of utilizing it is by utilizing hopefully well written effective emails to those licenses to introduce EZ Trim to them.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

And if that works for us and we can schedule a meeting, boy, that's a door we may not have been able to open without Cannabiz. And that's pretty invaluable for our company and I'm sure for many actually.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dave Zobl:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). So that's the nut of it. And then also again, just the information you guys put out. I get the MJB emails too of course. And I read them every day and they're helpful because things are changing so quickly.

Ross Dillon:

So quickly.

Dave Zobl:

And there's just so much going on that you could spend months just trying to stay up with it.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely. Even reading all the different emails from all the different companies and organizations, you're still not caught up just because it's so evolving, it's so quick.

Dave Zobl:

It really is. And I think again, as a small but solid company, it's really important that we remain nimble. The great thing about our products is they're adoptable to any size grow, from a backyard home grow to the large companies that we all know the names of. And we can adapt to both. 

So again, having that type of information on a daily basis really helps us to think, "Okay, should we go help adjust this direction or go this way?" So again, information is power as they say. It's very helpful.

Ross Dillon:

And that's great. We appreciate the kind words.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

Especially we have our data team, they work behind the scenes.

Dave Zobl:

Right.

Ross Dillon:

They don't often get the credit they deserve, but they're fantastic.

Dave Zobl:

Right.

Ross Dillon:

Fantastic people-

Dave Zobl:

Right.

Ross Dillon:

Who do a lot of work into making-

Dave Zobl:

Man, that is the name of the game, isn't it? I've been in other businesses and there's certain principles that just transcend and that all begins with the peeps in our team. Like I said earlier, I mean these folks, man, they have so much knowledge because they've done... And they've also failed as they would readily admit.

Ross Dillon:

That's how you learn.

Dave Zobl:

As we have too.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And we'll continue to.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And I guess it's not necessarily failure if you learn from it.

Ross Dillon:

And that's the biggest thing.

Dave Zobl:

We're all pretty big fans of the book “The Obstacle is the Way” by Ryan Holiday, which I don't know if you've ever read, but-

Ross Dillon:

I haven't, but I'm going to now.

Dave Zobl:

It's really a tremendous book and all his work is. But we always try to remind ourselves of that when we make mistakes, which we do, and go, "Okay, how do we learn from it? How do we handle it too?"

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

That's the biggest part is how do you handle it with your customer base?

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

Just come right out and say, "Hey, we messed this up. Here's what we'll do to fix it."

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. Well especially in the industry that's still growing, it's still super easy to do that.

Dave Zobl:

Big time. It is, yeah.

Ross Dillon:

And luckily, everybody in this industry understands that as well. So everyone's a little more patient with each other, yeah.

Dave Zobl:

We do find that overall, and no one feels worse than we do because we know, man, the love literally that goes into growing.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And it is hard work. Yeah. I mean there's art, there's science. And I didn't grow up on a farm, but I did grow up in Iowa. So I was surrounded by agriculture area and my mom's side of the family were all farmers. So have a running knowledge of how difficult farming is. But this just reiterates it. Whether I go to a small grow or some of these just huge grows, man, oh man, there is a lot of work that goes into this.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And as you alluded to, you can feel the passion part of it too, because it's really fun to talk to these growers because their eyes just light. It's their baby.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, it really is.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

And that's another thing in a lot of other industries, you don't get that passion that comes with it.

Dave Zobl:

Right.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

Oh my gosh. These growers are fantastic. And we try to the best of our ability to honor that because you spend all that time growing that plant, some of the time you trim and harvest it, we want to make sure we honor that.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

And show that plant the same respect-

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

And love really is the word. So that's what's cool about it too. So yeah, that's our story. We're in beautiful Colorado where Joe started it, like I said, about a decade ago and right about when legalization happened in Colorado. So he's the guy you want on the podcast. You want to talk about interesting. Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

Definitely. [crosstalk 00:22:04].

Dave Zobl:

He's seen and done it all.

Ross Dillon:

Oh, I'm sure.

Dave Zobl:

In fact, all our team has. Their combined history in the industry is pretty impressive.

Ross Dillon:

And that experience helps make your product what it is.

Dave Zobl:

Oh, dude. Yeah, it really does.

Ross Dillon:

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Dave Zobl:

Yeah, you learn as you go and we hopefully continue to try to improve. But we're proud of what we're doing, what we've done and optimistic the future. Despite COVID and everything going on, I am far from a prophet, but there's a lot smarter people than me that can predict where the industry's going. But I don't think I'm sticking my neck out by saying it's going to grow and change. It's going to grow and change.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

And that's what we have to try to continually be prepared.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah. So it's fun, man.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah. Well thank you, Joe.

Dave Zobl:

Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

I'm going to shout you out for putting this product on the market and putting this team together.

Dave Zobl:

Absolutely.

Ross Dillon:

And I want to thank you, Dave, for stopping by and having a chat with us.

Dave Zobl:

It's such a pleasure, man. And I really enjoyed it.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Dave Zobl:

Take care. We're eztrim.com, just in case you ought find us.

Ross Dillon:

Robert, good seeing you, man.

Robert Kenny:

What's up, Ross?

Ross Dillon:

What's it like being back at MJBizCon post-COVID?

Robert Kenny:

Oh my God. Every year it gets bigger and bigger. I didn't know what to expect. We're not wearing our mask, breaking all the rules right now. But I was definitely surprised by how large it is. There's a whole new room over there. We've got that room back there is completely filled up. I think 2019 was the last real Vegas BizCon, and they didn't even have this room all the way filled up.

Ross Dillon:

Really?

Robert Kenny:

Yeah.

Ross Dillon:

That's interesting. It just shows how much the industry's actually grown even over the past two years.

Robert Kenny:

100%.

Ross Dillon:

In the middle of a pandemic, which is incredible. It says a whole lot about the industry.

Robert Kenny:

I mean when they make cannabis an essential product.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah.

Robert Kenny:

I think all the projections, at least from what we were looking at, the projections that they were writing about the growth of the industry pretty much had to be rewritten on the good side, grew much quicker than anticipated.

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, absolutely.

Robert Kenny:

We're in packaging, and so that's great for packaging companies like ourselves.

Ross Dillon:

Oh, I bet.

Robert Kenny:

Our brands and our customers are-

Ross Dillon:

So talk about what Royal Supply actually does.

Robert Kenny:

Yeah. Royal Supply works with brands, B2B brands, working with manufacturing their packaging. So here's something right here, but we've got a full in-house design team. But yeah, it's all B2B sales on high volume packaging.

Ross Dillon:

That's awesome.

Robert Kenny:

Pretty straightforward.

Ross Dillon:

So how do you utilize the Cannabiz Media Database?

Robert Kenny:

So Cannabiz Media has been great from a number of different avenues actually. So we've got a sales team, a traditional sales team that has those B2B relationships. And from just a research perspective, they're making their campaigns off of it whether or not they are actually utilizing the email and marketing features within the platform, or we are taking it just as a research thing, curating our own list to be able to make calls or whatever. Then on the flip side of that, we've got our internal marketing team that is going to be utilizing the email aspects of things.

Ross Dillon:

That's fantastic.

Robert Kenny:

We've got our own email programs that we use in house that have our lists and everything. But it is incredibly easy to utilize those same emails, transfer them over into Cannabiz Media. And you've got what? 100,000 plus companies that you can now reach out to and access. So we definitely don't like to do the spammy markety just throw a bunch at the walls, see what fits.

Ross Dillon:

And that's good. We love hearing that more than anything that you actually do it the right way.

Robert Kenny:

Yeah. I mean we've definitely tried both ways. We didn't go in this knowing everything. It's like, "Oh man, these are not getting the best responses." But then you've got to curate your messages to-

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely.

Robert Kenny:

Sprinkle in some content as well as a little bit of markety gimmicky stuff.

Ross Dillon:

Absolutely, man. Well listen, you work with Julian, right?

Robert Kenny:

I do. Julian's the man.

Ross Dillon:

Julian is the man. You heard that, I'm sending this clip to you, Julian.

Robert Kenny:

What's up, Julian?

Ross Dillon:

Yeah, he's going to see this. All right, man.

Robert Kenny:

Hell yeah.

Ross Dillon:

I appreciate you stopping by. This was awesome. And we'll be posting this on social media probably afterwards. We're going to be sure and tag you all because-

Robert Kenny:

Awesome.

Ross Dillon:

We love having you guys as clients and really appreciate you stopping by.

Robert Kenny:

Fantastic. Well thanks so much, Ross. I appreciate it.

Ross Dillon:

No problem.

Ed Keating:

Tony, welcome to Cannabiz Media and our podcast. This is exciting because we never get to do them in person. So welcome to the booth and welcome to MJBizCon. So tell us a little bit about your company.

Tony Reyes:

Great. So Canna Carton is a packaging manufacturer. We make all cannabis packaging and we have a lot of traditional clients as well.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

But we focus greatly on child resistant pouches, boxes, labels, tubes, and jars and different things like that.

Ed Keating:

Got it. And are you also in other industries besides cannabis?

Tony Reyes:

We are. So the parent company, Carton Craft, has been around for over 30 years. We serve very large companies, the likes of S&P 500.

Ed Keating:

Yeah, yeah.

Tony Reyes:

And a few years ago, we saw an opportunity to help cannabis companies have a more reliable supply chain.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

And to help them manage their growing businesses. So we jumped in with both feet and it's been wonderful.

Ed Keating:

Excellent. So you're based in Illinois, but what is your customer set like? Are they all based in the Midwest? Do you have them nationwide, worldwide? Tell us a little bit about how you reach-

Tony Reyes:

They're all over.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

They're all over the United States. We do have a large focus and emphasis on the Midwest.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

But we have customers in most every legal market in the states.

Ed Keating:

Excellent.

Tony Reyes:

We haven't started sending anything overseas yet.

Ed Keating:

Hey, it'll be here before too long. I'm sure. So in terms of things that happen in the industry, for Cannabiz Media, we're always excited when new states come on because it means that someday, not quickly, new licenses will come out of the state. What does that mean for you? In my part of the country, the whole Northeast is awash with new programs.

Tony Reyes:

Yeah.

Ed Keating:

Does that mean anything for you, for your sales team? What do you do?

Tony Reyes:

Yeah. Well you know what? It's good for us to try and make relationships early on. When the markets are young, there are different challenges than when the markets are mature.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

And there's different demands on the producers and the cultivators and it's all coming from the customer, right?

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

So in those early markets where things are just coming on, there's a lot of enthusiasm and excitement. And sometimes, the markets are just immature and they need a little guidance. So we get in there as early as we can to try and help those folks deal with any of the challenges that may not have been in their purview before that. They may have not even known what some of the challenges of packaging and sourcing might be. So we get in there and try and give good guidance.

Ed Keating:

And does that guidance help with the compliance side? I know in Connecticut on the marketing side, when they rolled out the program, they put out an 18 page PDF that had every rule and reg. And I think it was the same that was true for tobacco, and they borrowed that from the Federal Trade Commission. Is that some of the guidance and advice you're able to give your clients?

Tony Reyes:

Well every state has its own, as you know, compliance.

Ed Keating:

Thank goodness, that's why we're in business.

Tony Reyes:

Right, exactly. So we do advise our customers to work closely with their teams and their legal advisors to make sure that their compliance is appropriate for their market and for the product that they're marketing. But we can be a good resource and a good sounding board. And of course, once they know exactly where they need to be for compliance, we can guide them into the right packaging.

Ed Keating:

And as you said before, since you're in multiple states, in some ways, you're like, if you will, a packaging MSO. This is not your first rodeo and you know what the rules are like in other places so that when people are choosing a firm on the packaging side, knowing that you've had to comply and package in other states has to be a big help.

Tony Reyes:

Yeah. People see that we're out there, they know who we're helping, and they do gain a lot of confidence, I think, seeing that other companies have had success working with us in various markets. But there's a lot of commonalities-

Ed Keating:

Sure.

Tony Reyes:

Between the different markets. There's different nuances really, and each state has its own advisors that tell them what they should be thinking about. But by and large, there's a lot in common.

Ed Keating:

Yeah. Yeah. And as each state, as we joke, is its own sovereign nation with its own rules and regulations that people need to be cognizant of. Got to ask you, how do use Cannabiz Media and the platform to hopefully help achieve those goals?

Tony Reyes:

Great. So Cannabiz Media is good for a couple things. It's good for us to help generate new leads and try and find some of the contacts that may not have been as readily available. It's pretty reliable.

Ed Keating:

Good.

Tony Reyes:

It's great. You guys do a very nice job. And basically, if somebody calls us and we don't know who they are.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

We also need to make sure that they've got proper credentials or licensing.

Ed Keating:

Sure.

Tony Reyes:

That's another good resource that we use.

Ed Keating:

Good. Yeah. So the validation piece. So that makes total sense. 

So here we are, it's been two years since we've had a conference here, everybody's looking forward. Any trends that you're seeing, Tony, that we should be thinking about as we finish 2021 and heading to 2022?

Tony Reyes:

Yeah. What we're seeing a lot of so far is automation.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

Totally to be expected. And that ties in well for us as a packaging supplier. We like to work closely with people's automation, suppliers, or partners to make sure that we're aligning the packaging with the automation solution. And that if there is an automation solution ahead of the packaging, we are being very thoughtful about marrying those two so that there's optimum efficiency.

Ed Keating:

Yeah.

Tony Reyes:

Which a lot of times leads to better quality of product for customers. So things like heat sealing different products-

Ed Keating:

Right.

Tony Reyes:

To maintain the integrity of the product or using things that would prevent light from degrading the product. Also, to your initial question, what are we seeing? Innovation around materials. So people are asking more about what's this plastic made out of? Is it sustainable?

Ed Keating:

Sustainable.

Tony Reyes:

Compostable? Do you have a compostable pouch material? And so we've worked hard over the last few years to develop solutions for all these questions. Like I told you, the parent company's been around for a long time and it's always been focused on sustainability. 

Also, I'm active in the NCIA Packaging & Labeling Committee, which is a great resource. If you're not aware of it, check that out. They have white papers on sustainable packaging. And a lot of people that are active with it are pushing sustainable resources and alternatives to traditional packaging.

Ed Keating:

Excellent.

Tony Reyes:

A lot of innovation happening.

Ed Keating:

Yeah. So keep an eye out for packaging and for automation as the future trends, you heard it here first from Tony. So thanks very much for coming by and talking with us.

Tony Reyes:

All right. Thanks, Ed.

Ed Keating:

All right.